So, the question popped up

[Deformat]

...a month nearly passed and no news whatsoever whether Ares is still on hold or not.

I am not trying to sound imperative, but 1st December passed a long time ago. This project has a community-wide importance so I got a bit shocked noticing that nobody asked this question in public.

[Renegade]

Community-wide importance? Really? Funny, I must've forgotten the love and dedication I felt from the community after all those news posts asking for help I wrote...

If this project truly is of "community-wide importance", and the community actually does care, it is free to join us in chat -or here- and offer to help out to speed up the process.
As it is, there will be news when we decide to post them.

Of course, if the community actually shared your feelings of Ares's importance, it would have joined us in chat months ago, and would be 100% up to speed about what's been going on. After all, it's not like we're being exceptionally secretive about what we did. Everything's in plain sight and has been discussed out on the open.

And it was so utterly important to the community that no one cared.

[Graion Dilach]

I am very happy to see these.... I miss a day (probably it'll get extended a whole week due to uni stuff -_-) and I find this post of denying everything. Niiice.

And meanwhile who asked me, I told that the reason behind the extended break is because the binary repo is unfinished. Because I was asked by the community. (YR Modder PMed me on the other day, Mevitar asked me on MO IRC, EricAnimeFreak asked me on MSN, random guys over MO shoutbox...)

I know what you feel, I know you had enough. But seriously, this state actually makes me mad, too.

Why do you expect anything from the community when you left the community in doubt? You killed off a feature request because it was on the wrong tracker, while I'm pretty sure, it was posted intentionally with the wrong setting, to have it posted... where the hell should the guy known that Mantis went out?

I asked you last week to post up a life sign. You rejected with your reason that there's no one who would you post... then tell me, why we had to abandon the working SVN system at the first place? Because then there was no one who would benefitted from that and I am pretty sure, if this move wouldn't happen/gets finished in time, stuff could roll again.

Community just doesn't care, fine. But the community is made up of a hundred younglings, knowing nothing, and only some oldbies, who already ran projects before Ares have started and half of them sticks to NPatch because NPatch-only logics are too deep within their INIs that they can't move now.

I know this makes you mad and the above reduces the community value to this 20%, but instead of considering the whole community as careless jerks, you should actually care about the guys who support you right now... because they might lose interest. I am getting close to it. Yesterday I was thinking and I realized... while I see interest in what I'm doing, the actual limbo state is what implies me to move over.

You have the mods with the biggest fanbases (MO, D-Day). If you seize Ares with this, guess how those would affect the reputation of RenProj as a whole. Unlike CnC-Source or DeeZire, RenProj still has(had?) a reason to follow... it's your decision if you want to kill it but then, you have to be aware, that move can kill your entire page.

No one cared... because the ones who cared have asked at other places and not directly you.

[AlexB]

While I concur the interest has been quite low the last few months, I can't deny the long vacation and radio silence also had a part in this. But this isn't the place for internal rants.

There is progress, though it is slow. For example, I still have at least two bugs and two non-bugs to fix (at least they shouldn't require extensive testing...). With a little bit of luck, three of them will be gone before the firework starts.

[Renegade]

I am very happy to see these.... I miss a day (probably it'll get extended a whole week due to uni stuff -_-) and I find this post of denying everything. Niiice.

Yes. There were no space aliens. It was all just a weather balloon.
Seriously, what am I "denying" here?

And meanwhile who asked me, I told that the reason behind the extended break is because the binary repo is unfinished. Because I was asked by the community. (YR Modder PMed me on the other day, Mevitar asked me on MO IRC, EricAnimeFreak asked me on MSN, random guys over MO shoutbox...)

Would you stop trying to frame this as me being mad? If all the interested people share their interest in secret with you, it's really not my fault that all I see is a sea of disinterest, is it?

Why do you expect anything from the community when you left the community in doubt?

I left? That's good to know! I thought I was right fucking here, and had been here longer than most of you.

You killed off a feature request because it was on the wrong tracker, while I'm pretty sure, it was posted intentionally with the wrong setting, to have it posted... where the hell should the guy known that Mantis went out?

That is just utter bullshit. I didn't "kill it off", I specifically requested him to repost it on the new tracker and gave him the URL to there.
The fact that you still identify it as a feature request despite the fact that it was a bug report shows just how wrongly it was filed.
Lastly, he could've known because it was utterly impossible to post on the Ares tracker (why do you think he posted in the wrong one?) and all other issues linked off-site.
I know this community is high on idealism, but every once in a while, you might want to look at things from an objective perspective.

I asked you last week to post up a life sign. You rejected with your reason that there's no one who would you post... then tell me, why we had to abandon the working SVN system at the first place? Because then there was no one who would benefitted from that and I am pretty sure, if this move wouldn't happen/gets finished in time, stuff could roll again.

Independent from the almost surreal segue there, feel free to ask D about the advantages of git, who has been advocating it for months, if not years - with me traditionally being the one who said there was no need to switch, SVN was working fine. Was it not you who remarked, on the very first day, how much better the new web interface was compared to the old one?
We switched to git because it was just plain better for development. Period.
The SVN repo is still up, so don't hesitate to merge ten branches in either repo, do a few dozen commits, and form your own conclusion.
I, for one, am very happy with what I've seen in the past two months.

Community just doesn't care, fine. But the community is made up of a hundred younglings, knowing nothing, and only some oldbies, who already ran projects before Ares have started and half of them sticks to NPatch because NPatch-only logics are too deep within their INIs that they can't move now.

I know this makes you mad and the above reduces the community value to this 20%, but instead of considering the whole community as careless jerks, you should actually care about the guys who support you right now... because they might lose interest.

Did I not tell, for months and in the grandparent reply, anyone who wanted that they're free to contribute and proceed while the three of us were on break?
Did you, personally not do exactly that by coding in a new branch and providing a custom DLL to MO?

Don't try to blame this on me.

You are the living, breathing proof that Ares can be developed just fine while we're on break. If nothing happened, development-wise, then that's because the community couldn't be arsed to do anything, not because evil, evil Renegade prevented anyone from it.

If the community was so amazingly interested, you could've gotten yourself a team of twenty coders and implemented all the missing NPatch features over the last four months.
Why didn't you?
Wait, don't tell me...you couldn't find anyone interested in actually working for Ares? How novel and unexpected...

I am getting close to it. Yesterday I was thinking and I realized... while I see interest in what I'm doing, the actual limbo state is what implies me to move over.

Again, all I can do is ask: Were you not the one having the single biggest DLL release in the past four months?
As far as the invisible, hypothetical community is concerned, were you not the singular Ares developer and releaser in the past four months?

Now let's kick perspective in the balls and frame this a little differently: While we were there, as far as I can tell from your comments, you enjoyed working on Ares.
While we were gone, you worked your ass off to write AttachEffect and MO's custom DLL for the community, and all it did was leave you frustrated and feeling unfulfilled, something at least D and I can very much understand.

Have you considered that, just maybe, you're simply having fun developing Ares with the rest of us? That the fun lies not in giving the community what it wants, but in mastering the challenge of the RTS engine from hell as a team?
Have you considered that, maybe, we're right about the community, and that that is exactly the reason why the fun was gone for you the second you were left alone with them?

Before you "leave the community in doubt", to borrow your words, I'd be very happy if you stuck around for another development cycle, and saw if maybe the pure development with us gave you joy. It'd be a pity if you gave up just because the community doesn't appreciate you. Because unlike them, we do.

You have the mods with the biggest fanbases (MO, D-Day).

Yeah, and what does it help us? Jack shit. The only ones testing every once in a while are the mods' creators, and even getting to that point took countless news posts begging for testers.
If there's anything I learned from this, then it's that the smaller mods are much more helpful for development - the big mods already have their laurels to rest on, their communities to please, their destinies to follow. The new and small mods are open for everything and willing to experiment.
Don't be blinded by the size of mods.

If you seize Ares with this, guess how those would affect the reputation of RenProj as a whole. Unlike CnC-Source or DeeZire, RenProj still has(had?) a reason to follow... it's your decision if you want to kill it but then, you have to be aware, that move can kill your entire page.

Clearly you haven't listened over the past four months...which explains the sheer number of your misconceptions. If zoom out a little and look at the grand scheme of everything we changed over the break, you will notice that RenProj is pretty much entirely out of the equation now.

It's something people never got: Ares is not a RenProj project. Never was, never will be.

No one cared... because the ones who cared have asked at other places and not directly you.

So how is the impression that no one cares my fault?

[Graion Dilach]

I have to think about your points. Maybe you're right. Yeah, I am frustrated and I don't know how to take it down. I amn't even right if I could say it after the above it's reason.

What I know... I still enjoy coding Ares itself, and I feel that if the haywire of the binary repo would be finished and the newspost introducing this new system would be posted, the stuff from my perspective could run again. But honestly, the moves were never announced officially on the main page, neither on ModEnc... if there wouldn't be the notices on the bugtracker, nobody would see why the tracker was down in the middle of November. Yeah, the move happened, but right now for me, it feels a "behind the scenes" move.

I have to think about especially the points where you try to figure out my joy in coding... maybe you've hit the nail on the head. I guess my January will be taken to rethink that... just after I passed the economy final exam on 2nd and the analysis on 4th.

I took the User Support Agent role months ago and I still do that on PPM (maybe that's the biggest reason why I follow PPM at the first place) and honestly, as the User Support Agent, I have to see points from the community side, even if there's nobody behind me.

[MRMIdAS]

Community-wide importance? Really? Funny, I must've forgotten the love and dedication I felt from the community after all those news posts asking for help I wrote...

If this project truly is of "community-wide importance", and the community actually does care, it is free to join us in chat -or here- and offer to help out to speed up the process.
As it is, there will be news when we decide to post them.

Of course, if the community actually shared your feelings of Ares's importance, it would have joined us in chat months ago, and would be 100% up to speed about what's been going on. After all, it's not like we're being exceptionally secretive about what we did. Everything's in plain sight and has been discussed out on the open.

And it was so utterly important to the community that no one cared.

There's no community-wide support, because ATM the community is waiting for the next version. as they were told to.

They don't pester because your attitude towards that hasn't been great, along with your dislike of "PPM n00bs", .

I'm on the new bugtracker, but didn't know of the change because I don't visit chat. I've tried on several occasions, it's been dead, so I've stuck to the forums, where, I assumed, news would get posted, and I could reply at a time when I was available. It is also somewhat counter-productive to have the bugtracker link still send you to the old bugtracker, not the new one.

As I've said before, It's your project, your website, your forums, you can do whatever with it. but complaining about the casual end-user who got told told to sit tight and wait for 0.2, for sitting tight and waiting for 0.2, is a bit daft.

I'm just as sorry that more people aren't as enthusiastic as I am about ares, but on the flipside, I can't say as I blame the people who DO want to see it for being quiet.

[¥R M0dd€r]

Community-wide importance? Really? Funny, I must've forgotten the love and dedication I felt from the community after all those news posts asking for help I wrote...

If this project truly is of "community-wide importance", and the community actually does care, it is free to join us in chat -or here- and offer to help out to speed up the process.
As it is, there will be news when we decide to post them.

Of course, if the community actually shared your feelings of Ares's importance, it would have joined us in chat months ago, and would be 100% up to speed about what's been going on. After all, it's not like we're being exceptionally secretive about what we did. Everything's in plain sight and has been discussed out on the open.

And it was so utterly important to the community that no one cared.

Ares is important. Just read on PPM on how many people waiting for 0.2.
Just because people don't want to test does is it not mean that people aren't interested. Got it? Some people have no idea have to test, others are to young to figure stuff out. Some are just busy with real life stuff/school.
People who are capable of testing are a minority. You had a fairly large group before(I don't know how many tester there are left today), but you fucked up with your unskilled autocratic management.

As I've said before, It's your project, your website, your forums, you can do whatever with it. but complaining about the casual end-user who got told told to sit tight and wait for 0.2, for sitting tight and waiting for 0.2, is a bit daft.

I am pretty sure pd gave this project to DCoder. It seems like Renegade stole it and took the role as the supreme leader.

[DCoder]

As I've said before, It's your project, your website, your forums, you can do whatever with it.

Rewind back to the point where Ren and I independently said that 0.2 would probably be the last release we're going to bother with. One of the key reasons we moved to GitHub and Launchpad was to make it easier for other people to get involved and eventually take over after we move on.

Just read on PPM

Yeah, I'll get right on that.

Just because people don't want to test does is it not mean that people aren't interested.

That's cool and all, but it doesn't help progress one bit.
(Pop quiz: if I publish a "final completed 0.2 public edition" tomorrow, how many of those "too busy with real life" people will suddenly find time to play with it?)

It seems like Renegade stole it and took the role as the supreme leader.

Or maybe I am more interested in actually developing than playing politics.

[Modder666]

I just want to test 0.2. Jesus Christ what the hell happened in this thread?

[DCoder]

Drama. The usual.

Testing builds will most likely be available in the next few days.

[eva-251]

While it's true there is a degree of apathy in this community toward Ares, the actions of the developers hasn't been conducive to reducing it- over the long term.

Hub site is empty; all it does is point to the RenProj IRC. There's no link to the forums, bugtracker, or even Ares. Somebody interested in Ares would have to use the IRC, google or another community site to get to any of this essential info, even if they knew it was hosted on Renegadeprojects.com. And as I've learned from experience and in my business courses, people kinda have a limited attention span when dealing with things on the internet.

Large chunk of the community is shunned; PPM's full of retards, no doubt, but it remains as one of the few active RA2/YR modding hubs, as Revora's CNC section slowly dies.

Information is poorly communicated; I had no idea the bugtracker changed, we moved to GIT, so on, until somebody posted on the bug-tracker and was responded with a link to the new tracker. While I haven't been an active tester in the last few months owing to inconsistent internet, heavy university work and being part of a competitive clan in another game, I would still check the bug-tracker and SVN a couple times a week and the forums whenever I was doing a round of my "sites to visit". Hell, when December rolled around, I started watching everything for a sign of activity and saw only a couple forum posts that didn't suggest much.

I never saw anything about the project moving and it seems this is the case for a lot of people, given that the new tracker is near dead.

[¥R M0dd€r]

(Pop quiz: if I publish a "final completed 0.2 public edition" tomorrow, how many of those "too busy with real life" people will suddenly find time to play with it?)

Many.

Anyway, this is not leading anywhere. So why is Ares 0.2 released yet? It was done in October. Lets look back. Ren wants Ares to be extremely stable before he release it. He would want tens of testers to hardcore test 0.2 for about two months(or more), if no bugs showed up at the bug tracker(then I mean no bug at all)(in case you have not yet understood, this is totally impossible), he would consider it stable enough to get released.
He didn't have these 50+ hardcore testers, so he and Nighthawk made news posts about wanting to recruit new testers. As we all know, few people signed up for testers, which disappointed Ren which is why he think people don't care about ares(which is false). As a result, Ares was frozen for three months.
So where is the problem? How should this be fixed?
Lower the standards. This "mega stable" 0.2 is not going to happen. Ever. First of all, you could never find 50+ hardcore testers. Second, even if you did find them, it could take a year of excessive testing. You should accept that there will be bugs in the public patch.
Then the management of this project is also a big problem. There cant be a supreme leader. There should be no "admin" or "lord"(Ren). Everyone, including the testers should make the decisions together. If example Garion, AlexB and eva-251 wanted to release 0.2 right now, and you(Ren) was the only one who resist, the patch should be released. If the release was a mistake, so what? Its not the end of the world. Fix-patches could be made.

I think, if we(at that time, I was a tester) released 0.2 in oct, and a month later made a 0.2b, we could today be done with 0.3. Pity.

[Renegade]

My word...don't you people have anything better to do on the last day of the year?

There's no community-wide support, because ATM the community is waiting for the next version. as they were told to.

I would love to see where any of us posted "ignore all calls for help, do not test, don't even think about helping us code before the next version is released".
That's bullshit, and you know it.
What we told the community is that, for public distribution and common man usage, they should use the stable builds. That's not equal to "be apathetic and pretend you don't give a shit about Ares".

They don't pester because your attitude towards that hasn't been great, along with your dislike of "PPM n00bs", .

If "helping", "testing" and "coding" all equal "pester" in your world, that tells a lot.
...and it explains my dislike of PPM n00bs.

I'm on the new bugtracker, but didn't know of the change because I don't visit chat. I've tried on several occasions, it's been dead, so I've stuck to the forums, where, I assumed, news would get posted, and I could reply at a time when I was available. It is also somewhat counter-productive to have the bugtracker link still send you to the old bugtracker, not the new one.

The bugtracker issue is really more of an aside. No point in getting hung up on. It was a single, particular incident Graion and I were involved in, and everything else is exactly the way it's expected to be at this moment.
So unless you're familiar with all variables in this (which you're not, 'cause you don't visit chat), there's no reason to debate the tracker.

As for news and the forum, you're mixing "news" as in "new developments" with "news" as in "organized, central announcements of recent developments". Ares News aren't a blog. We don't issue a news post for every single thing happening. If you want to stay up to date, chat is the only source of information you can rely on. News posts are issued when developments are done, not while they're happening. Which means one news post can sum up work you could have followed for months in chat before.

As I've said before, It's your project, your website, your forums, you can do whatever with it. but complaining about the casual end-user who got told told to sit tight and wait for 0.2, for sitting tight and waiting for 0.2, is a bit daft.

What I find daft is making up such a load of shit about what I was saying, both in this thread and before. For the rest of this answer, check a bit higher.

I'm just as sorry that more people aren't as enthusiastic as I am about ares, but on the flipside, I can't say as I blame the people who DO want to see it for being quiet.

Yeah...let's ignore the countless news posts and comments we made to the effect of "the only reason it's not released yet is because no one tests". Heaven forbid we look at reality and see that asking for involvement is all we've done for years.

[...]
People who are capable of testing are a minority. You had a fairly large group before(I don't know how many tester there are left today), but you fucked up with your unskilled autocratic management.

As hilarious as this statement is already, I'm gonna make this even better: Please provide historic evidence for your unsupported claim that, at any given time, we had a "fairly large group" of active, eager, useful testers.

I am pretty sure pd gave this project to DCoder. It seems like Renegade stole it and took the role as the supreme leader.

Your thoughts on Ares management would be a lot more interesting if your obvious ignorance weren't oozing from every single sentence you wrote in this thread.
Spend a month or two in chat, then talk again about Ares's internal structure.

While it's true there is a degree of apathy in this community toward Ares, the actions of the developers hasn't been conducive to reducing it- over the long term.

Oh, this is gonna be good. Blaming the victim is always fun!

Hub site is empty; all it does is point to the RenProj IRC. There's no link to the forums, bugtracker, or even Ares. Somebody interested in Ares would have to use the IRC, google or another community site to get to any of this essential info, even if they knew it was hosted on Renegadeprojects.com. And as I've learned from experience and in my business courses, people kinda have a limited attention span when dealing with things on the internet.

Awww...what a letdown. I was hoping for something outrageous, instead I got something pathetic. A pity.

Ares is not and never has been hosted on Renegade Projects.
Ares is a Strategy X hostee and its location at http://ares.strategy-x.com/ has always been broadcasted, including, but not limited to, the Ares readme coming with every release package.
You will find that the Ares site properly links to the news, forums and the bugtracker, as you expected.
Feel free to check the Web Archive if you need to check whether it's always been that way.

To be honest, if you don't even know where Ares's website is, then I'm having a hard time assuming you know enough about the project to take your opinion seriously.

My suggestion is the same as to YRM: Spend a month or two in chat, then talk again.

Large chunk of the community is shunned; PPM's full of retards, no doubt, but it remains as one of the few active RA2/YR modding hubs, as Revora's CNC section slowly dies.

So wait...the fact that both Nighthawk and I have, on multiple occasions, attempted to find someone to go to other forums and represent Ares is evidence that we shun a large chunk of the community?

More likely, this is just another point showing how little you actually know about what's going on here.
Maybe next to visiting chat, you should also catch up on Ares's news from the past year.

Information is poorly communicated; I had no idea the bugtracker changed, we moved to GIT, so on, until somebody posted on the bug-tracker and was responded with a link to the new tracker. While I haven't been an active tester in the last few months owing to inconsistent internet, heavy university work and being part of a competitive clan in another game, I would still check the bug-tracker and SVN a couple times a week and the forums whenever I was doing a round of my "sites to visit". Hell, when December rolled around, I started watching everything for a sign of activity and saw only a couple forum posts that didn't suggest much.

Please see the answers above on summary news posts as well as the pointlessness of getting hung up on the bugtracker.

I must say, though, that your entire argumentation looks a bit far-fetched: If you were so concerned about seeing activity, why didn't you just visit chat?

I never saw anything about the project moving and it seems this is the case for a lot of people, given that the new tracker is near dead.

See above.

(Pop quiz: if I publish a "final completed 0.2 public edition" tomorrow, how many of those "too busy with real life" people will suddenly find time to play with it?)

Many.

So basically, you openly admit they're dirty liars and aren't really busy, they're just too lazy to help?
That's really helping your argumentation.

[...] So why is Ares 0.2 released yet? It was done in October.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA
One would think you fell flat enough on your face last time you claimed that.
Apparently learning isn't your thing.

Lets look back. Ren wants Ares to be extremely stable before he release it. He would want tens of testers to hardcore test 0.2 for about two months(or more), if no bugs showed up at the bug tracker(then I mean no bug at all)(in case you have not yet understood, this is totally impossible), he would consider it stable enough to get released.

Please provide evidence for your polemic lies unsupported claims.

He didn't have these 50+ hardcore testers, so he and Nighthawk made news posts about wanting to recruit new testers. As we all know, few people signed up for testers, which disappointed Ren which is why he think people don't care about ares(which is false). As a result, Ares was frozen for three months.

By now, we have ventured into the realm of fiction. Will Dark Lord Renegade show mercy and release Ares from its icy prison? Can our noble hero YR Modder free the innocent library from Renegade's evil claws? Tune in next week for an all-new episode of Release Wars!

So where is the problem? How should this be fixed?

I suggest "getting informed". It's a novel concept where people actually read up on a topic before talking out of their asses for days.
I hear it improves conversation quality dramatically and vastly increases the probability of satisfying problem solutions.

Lower the standards. This "mega stable" 0.2 is not going to happen. Ever. First of all, you could never find 50+ hardcore testers.

I gotta give you this: You're consistent. Many amateur writers tend to get caught up in plot holes and contradictions, but your bullshit stays the same.
Have you considered helping The Amazing Doc Man with the documentation? We could use another writer for load balancing.

Second, even if you did find them, it could take a year of excessive testing.

Wow, you're conservative. My projection was a month for all branches with five testers, back in October.
Thank god you're not in charge of Ares, it'd never get released.

You should accept that there will be bugs in the public patch.

What?!?!? There's bugs in software?? WHY DID NOBODY TELL ME????

Seriously, though, style suggestion: If you must make up complete and utter bullshit, could you at least make up shit that isn't immediately negated by ancient, public documents?
Given the amount of bugs documented in the bugtracker to have been retargeted to future versions by all developers, including me, pretending that any of us would expect flawlessness is not just ridiculous, it's tragically futile.
I mean, seriously. I can only assume that was a weak attempt at misdirection and time waste.

Then the management of this project is also a big problem.

Ooooh, here we go again. People who have obviously, painfully not followed Ares at all making wild guesses about its internal decision making process based on obvious misinterpretations of out of context information.
Let's see what we get this time...

There cant be a supreme leader.

No really, you don't say? Do you mean to imply that, in a project where several different aspects of production need to be balanced, you need to have multiple, specialized people each overseeing one of these aspects and making decisions together in an equal, democratic way?

If only we hadn't spent so much time seeking consensus and asking for more participants...then we could've used that time to seek consensus and ask for more participants! We didn't know! WE DIDN'T KNOW!!! *sob*

There should be no "admin" or "lord"(Ren).

It's "Supreme Dreadlord", thank you very much. I considered going with "your highness", but I felt it didn't express the dark abyss of my evil soul quite right. Gotta foster the image, you know?

Everyone, including the testers should make the decisions together.

Yeah, let's have people making decisions about the future of Ares who couldn't even be arsed to post "feature X works" over the course of months.
Surely they are fully qualified to judge where we can go from where.

If example Garion, AlexB and eva-251 wanted to release 0.2 right now, and you(Ren) was the only one who resist, the patch should be released.

In sentences like this, the amount of your ignorance is just plain hilarious.
Did I tell you to visit chat for a while yet?
'cause, you know, you'd stop publicly embarrassing yourself if you did.

If the release was a mistake, so what?

Right! After all, the project isn't associated with you and your name, and you didn't invest any work in it, so who gives a shit if people get a bad impression, right?
I mean, come on? What's the worst that could happen? It's not like we'd have glaringly obvious bugs in the single player campaigns that'd make them impossible to play...

Its not the end of the world. Fix-patches could be made.

Right. Who'd have to code, check, package and release those, again?
Oh, right. Not you.

It's easy talking smack like that when others do the work, isn't it?

I think, if we(at that time, I was a tester) released 0.2 in oct, and a month later made a 0.2b, we could today be done with 0.3. Pity.

Yeah. With the feature set of 0.15. Total pity we didn't ruin our work and reputation to satisfy a random dude's release lust.

[DCoder]

Just for the record, that last post took him ~80 minutes to write. That's 80 minutes that could have been spent more productively.