Steel Mirage
19.02.2012, 09:33:47
Personally, as an "other contributor", I'm up to my eyeballs in school these days which is exactly where I want to be in general.
As far as where everyone else is, its not my place to speculate on where people "are".
What I observe, however, is that everyone appears to be stuck in a prolonged cycle of readjustment. Recently, the Bugtracker made a significant paradigm shift, and until all significant parties have reached the same level of fluency with the current program that was attained under the old SVN regime, this "activity-recession" will continue. Thats neither a positive nor a negative statement, its just the way things are.
That being said...
(queue the groans of "here goes Steel Mirage again)
On the issue of a "Standard Testing Procedure":
In a roundabout way, 4StarGeneral brings up a significant question, one that has been repeatedly asked and answered in the past year:
"As a tester, what the fuck do I do, and why can't you just tell me what to do?"
(or something like that)
In General Terms:
As a unified project, Ares tests the limits of how formal an informal project can be. The most significant limitation on Ares is the fact that, by necessity, there is no single member that can say "do this or do that in this fashion". And should someone attempt to give orders like that, the consequences would be a lot like trying to herd cats: everyone would scatter until the ruckus concluded.
(Renegade this is not me fomenting rebellion, just bear with me on this though process)
The reason for this is that the sole uniting factor of the people working on Ares is the common love for Red Alert 2: Yuri's Revenge. At least, thats what keeps me coming back. That and I enjoy the people here...
Other than that uniting factor, we all have lives and agendas that take precedence over involvement and activity within Ares. If someone were to take a dictatorial stance, the negative consequences would far outweigh the temporary relief that the testing corps would feel about someone giving them direction.
The Specific Controversy:
On an even more fundamental level though, that sort of "directed testing" has been established as also running afoul the "shit to pay" ratio:
The point of endless testing, as deemed necessary by Renegade and legitimized by the acclamation of all significant members of Ares (my perception anyways), is to discover as many possible foul-ups and fuckknuckleries as possible. This is a daunting goal even if applied only to the original programming (see the note in the manual credits regarding programmers and cannons). Ares adds a great deal of complexity to that. If the original programming were flawless, just making sure that Ares was stable would be a giant undertaking by itself. Adding Ares' layer on top of the original "spaghetti derpball" created by Westwood creates a testing twilight zone. Just getting to where we are now with the soup sandwich we were given should, by all rights, be a source of pride to everyone involved.
The point of the Bugtracker is to establish clear communication between the testers and developers in the form of clear cyclical testing and development.
Cyclical processes must have a starting point, and thats where the problem with directed testing, as some testers have demanded, lies. The entire testing process absolutely and fundamentally depends upon the ability of testers to find "unknown unknowns". Once they are known, they are documented in the Bugtracker and the cyclical process can begin. But if all testing is devoted to the "known unknowns", then the cyclical process will become circular, leading constantly back to the same exact point. End result is that no one gets anywhere, nothing gets done and Ares dies a slow heat-death.
This is why directed testing on a large scale is insufficient for the needs of Ares.
The Problem: Expectations
I would like to take a moment right here to thank and congratulate Renegade, DCoder and Alex_B for their commitment and ability.
They understand, sometimes implicitly, everything that I have said here so far. And understanding that, they continue to have patience, be supportive and work on what they can.
I want to be very clear here: All development of Ares absolutely and profoundly depends on the ability and commitment of competent testers to find the "unknown unknowns". Without that crucial element, Ares dies. Its that simple.
Knowing that, Renegade, DCoder and Alex_B (and others, to be fair, but these guys are the big three and we all know that) take pains not to use force to accelerate the progress of the testers. They cajole. They question. They plead. They do not order, they do not force anyone to do anything that they don't want to do. Why? Because this is an informal project, as stated above, and a dictatorial approach would mean the rapid bloody dissolution of Ares.
They are under no illusions of the ability of the testers. They understand that people have lives and that, at best, Ares represents a hobby, and one that gathers dust in most peoples hard-drives until boredom or guilt or re-discovery brings people back in. I am just as guilty of this as anyone, and its nothing to be ashamed of. Its just the nature of the project. And as much as the Big Three would love for rapid progress to occur, its not their place nor their wish to lash a slave force into blind obedience.
Because of that, and because their own efforts as developers (and whatever Renegade does :-D) depend on what the testers unearth from the goopy slime of Westwood's Grand Quagmire, Ares plods on at a very slow pace.
And yet folks have the grand expectations of a finished, release-worthy project now if not sooner (I speak in generalities here; if this offends someone its not my problem, check a mirror if you don't believe me). I'm guilty of it too on occasion. Expectations are a good and natural thing to have; without them, no one would bother to contribute to Ares. Elevated, unreasonable expectations, however, only serve to erode the efforts made by Ares' contributors.
When those unjustified expectations are laid at the feet of the leadership here, however, the earth trembles and lightning flashes in the skies (just read any of Renegades various "walls-o-text"; this essay pales in comparison). Then a rolling clusterfuck of fingerpointing and sometimes namecalling ensues as the pent-up dissatisfaction with progress comes to a fine rolling boil. Eventually we all go into our corners and the vat-of-shit thread is left to fester until referenced in the next rolling clusterfuck.
Nothing gets done, nothing changes, and eventually the process repeats itself.
In my opinion, this is really good and healthy and gives me hope. And usually makes me laugh my ass off, and as we all know, laughter is the best medicine.
A Solution?
Now that I have described the problem, (if ya'll went evidenciary demonstration, look things up on your own time, this essay is long enough on its own), I would like to propose a simple (-ish) solution.
Context: I have just finished a dissertation on the philosophy, ideology, strategies and mechanisms of student identity. My programmes and conclusions would adapt themselves nicely to Ares.
We already have a "Testing Area" forum. I would like to propose a sort of "So you wanna be a tester?" thread that would come at the top of the forum, the contents of which would be:
1. A definition of testing
2. A short description of a testing "process"
3. A short demonstration of testing (maybe a short video?)
4. A list of testing objectives
5. The reason that we test the way we do
6. A process for setting up individual testing strategies
7. Testing Tips and Tricks
This would give all current and prospective testers a one-stop place to get information for how and why they test. It orients testers and gives them a foundation from which to commence testing while at the same time not actually falling prey to the failures of "directed testing" (a strategy that does have a place, but only in specific areas, not the in the abstract general testing that we so badly need).
This provides support for the testers without further draining the time and resources of the organizers and developers. It would provide some unification of testing expectations, lexicon and procedures, which in turn would make communication with the developers more transparent and concise, making their lives easier, which would significantly improve all aspects of the Ares project.
It would also eliminate the need for the same questions to be answered individually again and again. If a tester has a question, he or she (heh, yeah right, just he) could be directed towards the "SoYWaBAT" thread (Maybe we could come up with a better title for a better acronym?). Really good questions and answers could be incorporated into the thread as a resource for future testers.
Even better, this could be a resource that outlives Ares or is useful to other modding organizations, which would bring further traffic to RenProj and make us all (and by us all,I mean Ren) much happier.
Implementation:
I see implementation taking not very long and not very much effort. I certainly wouldn't ask anyone else to put in more effort into it than I would. Even so, this could be up and running within a week with minimal effort.
As I see it:
Part 1: I would do this, after interviewing some folks.
Part 2: I would do this, after interviewing Graion.
Part 3: I would need someone else to do this, someone with experience testing and making videos of their testing. Could probably be done in an afternoon.
Part 4: This would be super simple and would come from Ren, DCoder and Alex_B, seeing as they are "the powers that be". Or they could just zap what they want to me and I could integrate and draft.
Part 5: This would be an excerpt from this thread and others.
Part 6: This would be my wheelhouse, after interviewing some folks.
Part 7: This would be seeded by some experienced testers and be built on over time.
I'm not gonna just unilaterally do this though:
We all have to agree that the status quo is insufficient for our needs.
We all have to agree that something can be done to improve the status quo.
We have to have some sort of consensus that my proposal is appropriate.
We have to understand the obligations that I put forth under "Implementation".
The great part is that once this is done, its done. It would need very little further maintenance.
Unleash the anti-air artillery!!!
As far as where everyone else is, its not my place to speculate on where people "are".
What I observe, however, is that everyone appears to be stuck in a prolonged cycle of readjustment. Recently, the Bugtracker made a significant paradigm shift, and until all significant parties have reached the same level of fluency with the current program that was attained under the old SVN regime, this "activity-recession" will continue. Thats neither a positive nor a negative statement, its just the way things are.
That being said...
(queue the groans of "here goes Steel Mirage again)
On the issue of a "Standard Testing Procedure":
In a roundabout way, 4StarGeneral brings up a significant question, one that has been repeatedly asked and answered in the past year:
"As a tester, what the fuck do I do, and why can't you just tell me what to do?"
(or something like that)
In General Terms:
As a unified project, Ares tests the limits of how formal an informal project can be. The most significant limitation on Ares is the fact that, by necessity, there is no single member that can say "do this or do that in this fashion". And should someone attempt to give orders like that, the consequences would be a lot like trying to herd cats: everyone would scatter until the ruckus concluded.
(Renegade this is not me fomenting rebellion, just bear with me on this though process)
The reason for this is that the sole uniting factor of the people working on Ares is the common love for Red Alert 2: Yuri's Revenge. At least, thats what keeps me coming back. That and I enjoy the people here...
Other than that uniting factor, we all have lives and agendas that take precedence over involvement and activity within Ares. If someone were to take a dictatorial stance, the negative consequences would far outweigh the temporary relief that the testing corps would feel about someone giving them direction.
The Specific Controversy:
On an even more fundamental level though, that sort of "directed testing" has been established as also running afoul the "shit to pay" ratio:
The point of endless testing, as deemed necessary by Renegade and legitimized by the acclamation of all significant members of Ares (my perception anyways), is to discover as many possible foul-ups and fuckknuckleries as possible. This is a daunting goal even if applied only to the original programming (see the note in the manual credits regarding programmers and cannons). Ares adds a great deal of complexity to that. If the original programming were flawless, just making sure that Ares was stable would be a giant undertaking by itself. Adding Ares' layer on top of the original "spaghetti derpball" created by Westwood creates a testing twilight zone. Just getting to where we are now with the soup sandwich we were given should, by all rights, be a source of pride to everyone involved.
The point of the Bugtracker is to establish clear communication between the testers and developers in the form of clear cyclical testing and development.
Cyclical processes must have a starting point, and thats where the problem with directed testing, as some testers have demanded, lies. The entire testing process absolutely and fundamentally depends upon the ability of testers to find "unknown unknowns". Once they are known, they are documented in the Bugtracker and the cyclical process can begin. But if all testing is devoted to the "known unknowns", then the cyclical process will become circular, leading constantly back to the same exact point. End result is that no one gets anywhere, nothing gets done and Ares dies a slow heat-death.
This is why directed testing on a large scale is insufficient for the needs of Ares.
The Problem: Expectations
I would like to take a moment right here to thank and congratulate Renegade, DCoder and Alex_B for their commitment and ability.
They understand, sometimes implicitly, everything that I have said here so far. And understanding that, they continue to have patience, be supportive and work on what they can.
I want to be very clear here: All development of Ares absolutely and profoundly depends on the ability and commitment of competent testers to find the "unknown unknowns". Without that crucial element, Ares dies. Its that simple.
Knowing that, Renegade, DCoder and Alex_B (and others, to be fair, but these guys are the big three and we all know that) take pains not to use force to accelerate the progress of the testers. They cajole. They question. They plead. They do not order, they do not force anyone to do anything that they don't want to do. Why? Because this is an informal project, as stated above, and a dictatorial approach would mean the rapid bloody dissolution of Ares.
They are under no illusions of the ability of the testers. They understand that people have lives and that, at best, Ares represents a hobby, and one that gathers dust in most peoples hard-drives until boredom or guilt or re-discovery brings people back in. I am just as guilty of this as anyone, and its nothing to be ashamed of. Its just the nature of the project. And as much as the Big Three would love for rapid progress to occur, its not their place nor their wish to lash a slave force into blind obedience.
Because of that, and because their own efforts as developers (and whatever Renegade does :-D) depend on what the testers unearth from the goopy slime of Westwood's Grand Quagmire, Ares plods on at a very slow pace.
And yet folks have the grand expectations of a finished, release-worthy project now if not sooner (I speak in generalities here; if this offends someone its not my problem, check a mirror if you don't believe me). I'm guilty of it too on occasion. Expectations are a good and natural thing to have; without them, no one would bother to contribute to Ares. Elevated, unreasonable expectations, however, only serve to erode the efforts made by Ares' contributors.
When those unjustified expectations are laid at the feet of the leadership here, however, the earth trembles and lightning flashes in the skies (just read any of Renegades various "walls-o-text"; this essay pales in comparison). Then a rolling clusterfuck of fingerpointing and sometimes namecalling ensues as the pent-up dissatisfaction with progress comes to a fine rolling boil. Eventually we all go into our corners and the vat-of-shit thread is left to fester until referenced in the next rolling clusterfuck.
Nothing gets done, nothing changes, and eventually the process repeats itself.
In my opinion, this is really good and healthy and gives me hope. And usually makes me laugh my ass off, and as we all know, laughter is the best medicine.
A Solution?
Now that I have described the problem, (if ya'll went evidenciary demonstration, look things up on your own time, this essay is long enough on its own), I would like to propose a simple (-ish) solution.
Context: I have just finished a dissertation on the philosophy, ideology, strategies and mechanisms of student identity. My programmes and conclusions would adapt themselves nicely to Ares.
We already have a "Testing Area" forum. I would like to propose a sort of "So you wanna be a tester?" thread that would come at the top of the forum, the contents of which would be:
1. A definition of testing
2. A short description of a testing "process"
3. A short demonstration of testing (maybe a short video?)
4. A list of testing objectives
5. The reason that we test the way we do
6. A process for setting up individual testing strategies
7. Testing Tips and Tricks
This would give all current and prospective testers a one-stop place to get information for how and why they test. It orients testers and gives them a foundation from which to commence testing while at the same time not actually falling prey to the failures of "directed testing" (a strategy that does have a place, but only in specific areas, not the in the abstract general testing that we so badly need).
This provides support for the testers without further draining the time and resources of the organizers and developers. It would provide some unification of testing expectations, lexicon and procedures, which in turn would make communication with the developers more transparent and concise, making their lives easier, which would significantly improve all aspects of the Ares project.
It would also eliminate the need for the same questions to be answered individually again and again. If a tester has a question, he or she (heh, yeah right, just he) could be directed towards the "SoYWaBAT" thread (Maybe we could come up with a better title for a better acronym?). Really good questions and answers could be incorporated into the thread as a resource for future testers.
Even better, this could be a resource that outlives Ares or is useful to other modding organizations, which would bring further traffic to RenProj and make us all (and by us all,I mean Ren) much happier.
Implementation:
I see implementation taking not very long and not very much effort. I certainly wouldn't ask anyone else to put in more effort into it than I would. Even so, this could be up and running within a week with minimal effort.
As I see it:
Part 1: I would do this, after interviewing some folks.
Part 2: I would do this, after interviewing Graion.
Part 3: I would need someone else to do this, someone with experience testing and making videos of their testing. Could probably be done in an afternoon.
Part 4: This would be super simple and would come from Ren, DCoder and Alex_B, seeing as they are "the powers that be". Or they could just zap what they want to me and I could integrate and draft.
Part 5: This would be an excerpt from this thread and others.
Part 6: This would be my wheelhouse, after interviewing some folks.
Part 7: This would be seeded by some experienced testers and be built on over time.
I'm not gonna just unilaterally do this though:
We all have to agree that the status quo is insufficient for our needs.
We all have to agree that something can be done to improve the status quo.
We have to have some sort of consensus that my proposal is appropriate.
We have to understand the obligations that I put forth under "Implementation".
The great part is that once this is done, its done. It would need very little further maintenance.
Unleash the anti-air artillery!!!
FormerAres Documentation Manager
Nobody here but us trees...
Good one!
Nobody here but us trees...
Graion Dilach Wrote:Worm, you know this guy is an American lawyer of some sort.
Good one!