WoRmINaToR
07.11.2010, 17:38:42
(This post was last modified: 07.11.2010, 18:16:06 by WoRmINaToR.)
Not like M666 will be back to see this anytime soon, but a couple small things I wanted to point out:
Furthermore, the claim alone that builds of Ares (even testing ones) are unstable is quite bullshit. I have not had a single crash from Ares that wasn't either my own mistake or a result of (what I think is) using widescreen resolutions (which are forbidden in YR online play for a reason), or a crash caused by an in-development feature that is expected to have bugs anyways.
And I've been testing this thing and actively using it almost daily since revision 270, and I've been keeping up-to-date for the most part and testing most of the major revisions, and several branch ones.
Oh, come on, now. Aren't you the beta tester that bitched at me in his Red Alert X forums about my extensive criticism and feedback for the mod (and then found yourself at a loss when Fen acknowledged my criticisms and told you to pipe down)?
That mod DOES use Ares, you know.
And to all those assertions you made that the community is too stupid to understand and accept Ares' more involved development structure, testing system, and manual... I say, "Who cares?" If they are too stupid for us, we don't need them. I know I sound like an elitist asshole, but honestly. If they are too dumb for Ares, then they can stick with their significantly dumber NPatch if that works for them. I personally think the bugtracker system is an indescribably helpful resource for managing issues and feature requests, but it does require that the submitters of issues file their issues correctly. The SVN is an advanced system for backups and version control, and it should only be handled by experienced individuals anyways. Launch Base was made to support Ares for a reason. The manual is incredibly detailed and is an immense resource for understanding Ares features and how they are implemented and what they do. I know it takes a reasonable degree of intelligence to understand some of the more complicated features, but those features are generally those which require more intelligence to understand how to implement anyways. That is not the manual's fault, and it's not the Ares coders' fault.
I think that if we can have an active community of intelligent modders right here at Renegadeprojects that understands this system, understands Ares, understands the manual, and puts it all to good use, then no matter how small the community, I think it will have made enough of a difference for enough mods.
Of course, that's my personal belief. If Renegade's major object of this project is to get the bulk of the RA2/YR modding community to support this patch, that's his initiative, and on that note I understand his frustration with the community. I care more about how this patch has made my modding experience so much better, and I care about the several people who have participated in this project and have used Ares in their own mods and have benefitted from it. If the rest of the community doesn't particularly care about us right now, let them stay with their stupid NPatch. Then, in a year or two, let's see how they feel about the progress of certain major mods that do use Ares, and let's see how they feel about how much more awesome those mods are for it.
M666 Wrote:Don't forget that NPatch has online stability that can't ever get tested by Ares by the slack testers.While I did not report this, I have tested a significant multitude of times with several different people and I found that Ares is completely stable whilst playing online, at least with two human players. It got dicy when AI was involved but I think that's mostly issues on my part.
Renegade Wrote:And if 0.1 P1 is unstable, I have yet to hear about it. Maybe he's talking about the exact reason we're trying to keep testing versions out of sight - morons judging Ares by unstable builds.While I have made the mistake of showing certain morons these unstable builds, I want to emphasize Renegade's point here because it's an important one.
Furthermore, the claim alone that builds of Ares (even testing ones) are unstable is quite bullshit. I have not had a single crash from Ares that wasn't either my own mistake or a result of (what I think is) using widescreen resolutions (which are forbidden in YR online play for a reason), or a crash caused by an in-development feature that is expected to have bugs anyways.
And I've been testing this thing and actively using it almost daily since revision 270, and I've been keeping up-to-date for the most part and testing most of the major revisions, and several branch ones.
M666 Wrote:Another nitpick (yes, I seem like an ass but it's only fair to mention) point is that Fen's only released stock RA2/YR modifications
Oh, come on, now. Aren't you the beta tester that bitched at me in his Red Alert X forums about my extensive criticism and feedback for the mod (and then found yourself at a loss when Fen acknowledged my criticisms and told you to pipe down)?
That mod DOES use Ares, you know.
And to all those assertions you made that the community is too stupid to understand and accept Ares' more involved development structure, testing system, and manual... I say, "Who cares?" If they are too stupid for us, we don't need them. I know I sound like an elitist asshole, but honestly. If they are too dumb for Ares, then they can stick with their significantly dumber NPatch if that works for them. I personally think the bugtracker system is an indescribably helpful resource for managing issues and feature requests, but it does require that the submitters of issues file their issues correctly. The SVN is an advanced system for backups and version control, and it should only be handled by experienced individuals anyways. Launch Base was made to support Ares for a reason. The manual is incredibly detailed and is an immense resource for understanding Ares features and how they are implemented and what they do. I know it takes a reasonable degree of intelligence to understand some of the more complicated features, but those features are generally those which require more intelligence to understand how to implement anyways. That is not the manual's fault, and it's not the Ares coders' fault.
I think that if we can have an active community of intelligent modders right here at Renegadeprojects that understands this system, understands Ares, understands the manual, and puts it all to good use, then no matter how small the community, I think it will have made enough of a difference for enough mods.
Of course, that's my personal belief. If Renegade's major object of this project is to get the bulk of the RA2/YR modding community to support this patch, that's his initiative, and on that note I understand his frustration with the community. I care more about how this patch has made my modding experience so much better, and I care about the several people who have participated in this project and have used Ares in their own mods and have benefitted from it. If the rest of the community doesn't particularly care about us right now, let them stay with their stupid NPatch. Then, in a year or two, let's see how they feel about the progress of certain major mods that do use Ares, and let's see how they feel about how much more awesome those mods are for it.